Transcendence Cabaret. In conversation with Eun Bee Yes.

Dr Alex Iantaffi interviews Eun Bee Yes, the fabulous founder, show director, and producer for Transcendence Cabaret, a trans, genderqueer, two-spirit, and gender expansive drag troupe that centers BI&POC artists in the Twin Cities.  They discuss the importance of representation and mentorship in the drag scene, the evolving nature of drag as a form of artistic expression, and safety concerns in the current socio-political climate. Listen for an uplifting conversation on the nourishing aspects of trans community, queer art, and the transformative power of drag in the face of oppression.

Transcendence Cabaret is an amazing troupe with some of the best well-known and up and coming artists in the Twin Cities. They are transgender, genderqueer, gender non-conforming, two spirit and truly all along the spectrum of gender and sexuality. Transcendence Cabaret’s artists are primarily BI&POC and they are one of a handful of transgender troupes who center artists of color on Turtle Island, in the so-called United States. They offer an up and close personal experience and a spotlight on often overlooked talent within the unique drag, music, and art community. Their aim is not only to entertain their audiences, but to push themselves as artists, in a rare opportunity to challenge the perceptions of our communities, and to make art from their heart and soul. You haven’t seen anything yet until you’ve spent an evening with them! Transcendence Cabaret invites you to join them each month in a constantly evolving show. Ready to go above and beyond the binary? Allow them to be your guide! All shows are hybrid and can be enjoyed from anywhere in the world, if you’re not a local. 

Find out more about Transcendence Cabaret, including upcoming shows, at the following links: 

www.transcendencecabaret.com

Facebook- Transcendence Cabaret

Instagram- Transcendence Cabaret

Instagram: GenderStories
Hosted by Alex Iantaffi
Music by Maxwell von Raven
Gender Stories logo by Lior Effinger-Weintraub

Transcript

Alex Iantaffi: 0:34

Hello and welcome to another episode of Gender Stories. As always, I am delighted and excited and thrilled really because Eun Bee Yes is not only the founder, show producer and director of um Transcendence Cabaret, which I will tell you all about it in a moment, but he's also wonderful colleague and friend. And so I feel so privileged to get to talk to him today. First of all, let me tell you about Transcendence Cabaret. Transcendence Cabaret is an amazing troupe with some of the best well-known and up-and-coming artists in the Twin Cities. They are transgender, genderqueer, gendernonconforming, Two-Spirit, and they're really all along the spectrum of gender and sexuality. The artists from Transgender Cabaret are primarily Black, Indigenous, and People of Color, and they're one of a handful of transgender troupes on Turtle Island, aka the so-called United States. who centers artists of color. Transcendence Cabaret offers an up-and-close personal experience and a spotlight on often overlooked talent within the unique drag music and art communities. Their aim is not only to entertain their audiences, but to push themselves as artists in a rare opportunity to challenge the perceptions of their communities and to make art from the heart and soul. And I can assure you, having seen some of their shows that you truly haven't seen anything yet until you spent an evening with Transcendence Cabaret. And they invite you to join them each month in a constantly evolving show. And if you don't live in the Twin Cities, don't worry, because I believe that their shows are also still being live streamed. And so you can join from really anywhere as long as you can be up at that time. So anywhere on the globe. So if you're ready to go. Above and Beyond the Binary, I really encourage you to watch one of their shows and let Transcendence Cabret be your guide. So welcome, Eun Bee Yes You are the founder, show director, producer for Transcendence Cabaret, and I'm so, grateful that I got to talk with you today. Welcome.

Eun Bee Yes: 2:48

Oh, thank you, Alex. It's so good to see you. Oh my gosh. Colleague and friend and chosen family and all that. And yeah, when you when I got the invite, I was like, oh, no way, because your Gender Stories are amazing. And I know a lot of people love it is like it really is an honor and a distinction to be included in this season's stories. You know, know you'll probably have a whole lineup of fantastic. ah interviewees, so for us to be part of the season's stories really means a lot on a personal professional level. So yeah, thank you.

Alex Iantaffi: 3:26

Thank you so much. I feel much the same about you making time for this. I know you're like really busy, you know, not just with Transcendence Cabaret, but with your, you know, your day job, your community organizing. And I feel like my invite was much overdue. And so I'm excited to talk to you about your troupe And so my first question is really like what moved you to like create Transcendence Cabaret, right? Like there are many, many different troupes out there that do drag and the Twin Cities as if Fair number, I would say, of the houses and like a large drag community. So why Transcendence Cabaret? What kind of inspired you to create your troupes?

Eun Bee Yes: 4:08

Right, well, back in 2016, 2017, I did a fundraiser. So I, at the time, am now part of the Imperial Court of Minnesota, which is a nonprofit organization, part of the Imperial Court system, an international system nonprofit. And we do fundraising for the community and for nonprofits in the community. And prior to that, there really hadn't been a two things. One, uh show for specifically trans, non-binary, Two-Spirit organizations, nonprofit organizations to raise money for them through the Imperial Court, at least in Minnesota. And two, that featured all trans artists. And that's the key, right? So we had this fundraiser, first of its kind really, in the Imperial Court here in Minnesota. raised a lot of money, and it was all trans artists, not one cisgender, drag, or burlesque artist. And one of the things that we often say, and this is of course I think as it should be a holdover from, let's see. civil uprisings and community activism work. And from the 80s and the 90s, the days of the AIDS crisis when it's, give us our bread and roses now. You know, that's an old, old quote. But give us now, don't wait till we're dead and say, accolades, you know, we don't, that's not helpful. And I got to thinking about all of that. And as always, you you stand on the shoulders of the giants before you. So I stand on the shoulders of my trancestors, as we coined that, right? um Marsha P. Johnson, Sylvia Rivera, the people who in Stonewall and Compton cafeteria, know, the uprisings then of our trans brothers and sisters and siblings and primarily People of Color, especially Black and brown, who led the whole, you know, um fight against homophobia, transphobia, and all of that, and brought about pride. So to stand on those shoulders is humbling, and to carry on that work is important. So after that fundraiser, I was like, oh my God, this is amazing, we should have more of this. I'm like, well, why don't we have more of this? So in 2017, I approached the then managers of Lush and said, hey, Would you be interested in us having a monthly show featuring all trans artists and primarily Black Indigenous People of Color artists, primarily, and then of course some white artists as well, but all trans. It's an all trans period. I'm not interested in centering cisgender at all because dominant society always centers cisgender and Here in Minneapolis, St. Paul and the surrounding communities, we still have, it's mostly cisgender, troupes, drag shows and whatnot, burlesque shows. It's gotten better, to be fair, since then, you know, it's gotten a lot more eclectic and a lot more better. And so 2018, we had our very first show there at Lush. And this is like our eighth year, right? Eight consecutive year and 2020, epidemic, that epidemic, COVID epidemic, I should say, started and everything shut down. And you you mentioned the hybrid. are now the only monthly show that has a option. We are at the Phoenix Theater and we moved from Lush to the Phoenix. And well, first we moved to online only that first you saw that that March show was interesting on zoom because we didn't know what we're doing and things about and then we got lots better. And then we moved to Phoenix eventually. We were at this small, very intimate little place called the Midnight Theater, which is really amazing. And my friend ran that and then they could no longer be there. It's like now what? And I chose Phoenix because it had built in streaming capabilities. So now among these shows that Phoenix are streaming and it's still mandatory masking. So in-person mandatory masking, no exceptions. And then we have the streaming on our YouTube channel where like you said, anywhere in the world, people can just subscribe. You know, they get a ticket, they get an automatic link and they can come in person. with a masc or they can go online and it can stream. to answer, go back to your original question as we started, because representation is important, because BIPOC representation is important. When you have the intersectionality of BIPOC, trans, non-binary, and especially Two-Spirit, a representation within the artistic community back in 2017, 2018. that was scarce on the ground. And so I really wanted to center our communities that way and start a troupe that was really um revolutionary in the cities at that time. And now it might be like, this is old hat. And again, people standing in our show to say, know, transcendentists, they will then we also, and it's like, absolutely. Let's expand beyond. So it's more common, right? Now it seems more common. you know, we have troupes, people who are within the trans community. No one blinks an eye. And I'd like to hope that when we started in 2018, our, my goal was to make that less of a singular thing and more of a common occurrence. And if it's more common occurrence now, then we did our job. Absolutely. You know, when you were saying like, it is more common now. And I was like, and you were part of that change. Like you, I really believe that at least in the Twin Cities, Transcendence was very much part of that change of that shift towards, you know, giving opportunities as well, because it's not just about the representation, it's also the opportunities for growth, right? I love what it says in the bio for Transcendence Cabaret, that it's also about pushing kind of artistic expression, right? And I... I would assume that for a lot of Black, Indigenous, know, Folks of Color who wanted to enter the drag scene, and then on top of that trans, you know, the Two-Spirit, gender, expansive, non-binary, there would have been multiple barriers to access traditional drag scene. And so I'm also curious about, you know, having a space like Transcendence is also a place for mentorship and like an entry point for artists, right? Or at least I'm assuming so. Yeah, because I had original troupe and then as people would be guest artists on our shows, I like to think I have an eye for it, of really great talent, and I'd ask them to join, especially BIPOC. And then after a while, these people would catch the eye of other show directors and other house leaders, parents, and join houses and then... They'd be like, you know, I love my time with Transcendence and I'm not too time to move on. It's like, you know, yeah. I mean, I'm sad to see them go because it's bad. But, you know, as parents and you and I also parents, I think one of the big goals we want is our kids to go beyond us. So even though this wasn't like a house traditional, but maybe it kind of is right. Because when you think of like the ballroom scene. and the houses and the competitions. was people bound together by chosen family and talent and their houses and competing. And though we don't compete per se, it is, I tried to do two things. One, the mentorship and the safety to do your art. So our shows are not necessarily mainstream drag and there's nothing wrong with mainstream drag. if you go back, like you mentioned the history of drag, drag was subversive. You weren't supposed to do drag you know? And I think also, I also understand flip side, where some trans people, especially trans women, be like, well, drag is mocking us as women. It's like, my God, wasn't supposed to be like that at all. And for those drag artists to do that, you need to correct yourself because drag really was, how dare you tell me that I can't get into fem, fem. or female or femme presenting and do art. Or later on, oh masc masc presenting and do art. And that's still an issue, right? Because drag King's masculine-centered art has seen us less than, which absolutely burns my biscuits, as our grandmas used to say, because you don't gatekeep. Gatekeeping does not belong in a community. So to go back to the origins of drag, it's a... you get to interpret drag how you want to interpret drag. And if you want to do mainstream pop stuff by all means, but for elevated, however you want to elevate that. But I encourage the subversiveness. Like if you want to do that cool, weird, funky art, if you want to do, I call it activist drag. And maybe I coined that where you like take an issue and you do a number around it and you just expand that whether it's around. you know, AIDS, HIV, whether it's around safe sex, whether it's around consent, whether it's around kink, polyamory, whether it's around Gothic stuff, know, alternative drag and all this is like big now. But again, that stayed in the shadows for so long because that wasn't drag. And I'm going to say, no, that's not, that's not true. There's, drag is so big. There's so many things that can do with, with drag that There should not be any gatekeeping. What I want is good. I want you to do the best. I don't want you to come and just like sleepwalk. Then this true person for you and our shows aren't for you. You're not going to see that in our shows. Those aren't the artists I want in my troupe. I want people who want to perform and have this voice and heart and spirit. that says when I'm on stage, I'm doing this thing. And when I'm doing this thing, it's because I had an idea or I had my muse or whatever. And I just crafted everything from the ground, from the ground up. And so that's the mentorship that I wanna bring. I wanna bring that safe space. And then beyond that, I want people to go above and beyond and go out. And maybe they're no longer with us, but then I see them. getting bookings and doing other shows and being in their houses and just doing amazing things in the drag community. And I think that's amazing. It's like, wow, aren't we lucky? So about a year so ago, one of my artists, Moe Russell, Honor Yes. You you gotta remember all the names here. Approached me and said, I got an idea. And I said, okay. And what their idea was was to create an open stage show. And there's a lot of them, but here's the thing. It's not a judged show. It's not honest reaction. You win. We don't have prizes. It's first come, first serve, first five. We had to tweak it now to five. We've had six or seven. That was just, that was a lot. So now we've got it honed down to five artists, open stage, two numbers, know, two sets, split tickets, split tips. You get to do whatever you want. And this is open stage where you don't have to be trans. We really are. This is open to everyone because again, drag and this is everything. drag, burlesque, spoken word, comedy. um Amazing. whatever your muse wants you to do, you do it. So I said, yeah, let's do it. And so that's called Spotlight, Late Night Spotlight, because that's always, it's too late for a lot of people, but it's a 10.30 PM show. I know, I'm so sorry. It's at 10.30 at night at the Phoenix, but it's live streamed. It's streamed against the hybrid shows so people can watch from wherever. And we open it up to everyone, whether you're a veteran and You know, how we pitch it is, if you're a veteran, you've got a new act that you want to just see how this feels on stage. See how it feels to as you move, as you do your first choreography on stage for the first time, as you do your makeup or your outfits a certain way. How does that look? How does that feel? Okay, try it out. And of course, the newbies, the new people. Never stepped on stage. I've always dreamed of being on stage. I've always wanted to try. It's like this is your open opportunity to try it, to network. And, you know, we have show producers watching, we have other artists watching going, hey, you know what? We've got a show. Why don't you, I'm going to like pitch you. I'm going to like tell my director, this artist was amazing. I think we should have them as guest artists. So again, it's all about creating that space. where you can not only do that art, but you have opportunities, you have networking, you get to see what it's like, you've got a broad audience, I get a safe environment, you cheer, there isn't, you don't have to worry about being judged. Although this year we had three opportunities of mentorship, not judging, mentors, where we'd have four mentors from the community who I chose. who I thought were kind and caring and compassionate, who would truly give feedback that would elevate these artists. And our total spotlight is, the theme is called Gentleman's Choice. And it's, I got four gentlemen mentors and this is centered about masc-centered art. So like I said, drag kings are often looked down on, are often marginalized. And I said not. not at this specific show. Not only is it all masc-centered art, we're bringing in four gentlemen um to be mentors to say, this is great. Here's how to elevate the look or the number or how you do the choreography so that they can tweak that number and really refine it and really maybe make it, you know, their showstopper number or the number that they're known by or number that they might use. you very much. to enter a competition or something, that's what the mentor shows up for. And spotlight overall is that mentoring opportunity that we want to give open stage, no judging, no competition, just that opportunity. So like you said, Alex, that mentoring is important, that nurturing is important. And so Transcendence overall, um That's what we do is we encourage the art and the mentoring and the safety and the supports that people can really create art that speaks to them. And that the audience could go, I have never seen that. We hear that. I have never seen that at a show before. um And then we're going, great, come back, come back, bring friends, come back, you know, cause it really makes our artists happy to see. people and the audience just absolutely thrilled and, you know, just have that wonder and that joy to share that art with. Absolutely. And that's what I love about Transcendence. It's so innovative, it's so fun. It's also just beautifully produced, of course. But it really feels so consistent with me, with the true spirit of drag, as somebody who's been out as queer for, I don't know, over a quarter of a century. Now, let's really seeing kind of, I think that when I first came out, Drag was really interesting because I felt there was a real contrast between the way that cisgender gay men, to be honest, did drag, especially white cisgender gay men, because I think there's an issue, there's a difference, right? There's an influence of white supremacy even on the drag scene in some ways, right? It's like if I think the way that white cis gay men were doing drag in the 90s is very different than what we're talking about. oh I feel like the way Transcendence does drag, really there feels like there is that connection to ballroom culture, to the house culture, to like, and that was really like, Folks of Color where it was very different, you know, in my understanding and having been, having had the privilege and the gift to go to some kind of ballroom events is such a different event than like cis white gay man doing drag, to be honest. And so You know, that's what I love about Transcendence that it's drag is not just about uh playing with gender, but it's truly about inviting people to question the norms, right? Even of gender question the boundaries of artistic expression, right? And really question all those like binaries that we might tend to fall back on in dominant culture and think. bigger, larger, brighter, more creatively, right? I just love the expansiveness of the shows, right? And to me that expansiveness is how I've experienced ballroom culture as an outsider. It's the expansiveness of how I think about what drag can bring to the world. And it does make me wonder if that is why there's been such a backlash. on the drag scene in the past few years, because as the scene has really honored this tradition of ballroom, uh brought us this amazing expansive artist and more artists of color, more Indigenous artists, more trans artists, right? Even in mainstream drag, if I think about, I think about drag race as a little more mainstream, right? And even seeing the shift that there's been in shows like Drag Race, right? if that starts to be a threat to a system or a dominant culture that wants more constriction and more rigidity and more binaries, whereas like drag really brings creativity and possibility and expansion for art. I don't know if that makes sense or if you resonate with any of that. Yeah, yeah, because you know, I mean, obviously, we've had this whole thing about drag story time, which really is sad. Because I've been I've had the privilege of doing drag story time. And when I'm looking at an audience of little children in their eyes are big and white. And I'm reading to them a story about, you know, feeling like a crayon. You know, there's that one book about You know, where you have a red crayon or a green crayon on the outside and a red crayon on the inside, right? And then you finally take off the wrapper and you're the red crayon and you're accepted. Finally, for who you are, obviously allegory, trans allegory. But when you read this to children who are three, four, five, six, seven years old, we're not talking about mix of cisgender, it may be queer, trans children. sure you see the rainbow pins and the trans pins sometimes with them but all I see are children who are like going this is a cool story and can I touch your dress? Can I you know can I can I look at your you can touch your dress can I look at your makeup and the hair can I have a photo and and it's not pushing an agenda right the only agenda pushing is first of all reading literacy and knowledge and being together as a community. And when I see all these children, regardless of race, regardless of gender, whatever, enjoying a story, that's all I'm doing is I'm sharing a story and then we get photos and I'm chatting to them and they're asking me the best questions like, your makeup is so sparkly. Yes, how do you make your makeup so sparkly, right? you do that? And then they want to look at my nails. So they want to try my rings. And I'm like, well, you know, I don't understand that hate. Because I don't think any of these people have actually attended a drag story time, honestly. They'd be saying, you're telling a story. I'm like, yeah. Yeah, and just looking fabulous while you do it. And that's the thing. Yeah. And that's why I think drag is such a beautiful celebration of imagination and possibility and what happens when we're not limited by constriction, right? If I think even, you know, my daughter, who you know, like... has been exposed in air quotes to drag since she was little. I think she probably saw her first drag show when she was like five or six, right? And she's in her twenties now and I'm pretty sure she would be fine with me saying this, but I'll check in with her. worry. Before I release this episode. And if you hear this Gender Stories, listeners or watchers, if you're watching on YouTube, please rest assured that this story is going to be shared with her consent. I will make sure I get her consent. but she's one of the most cisgender girls I've ever met. know what I mean? Like even my friends would tease me when they came to our house and be like, it looks like a pink dragon is puked all over this room. This is your child, you know, from this very queer household, you know? And she's always loved femininity. And for her drag was just this like beautiful, expansive celebration of femininity, right? And I remember after she saw her first all ages, of course, family-friendly drag shows, because sometimes people don't understand that there are kind of adults-only drag shows, but there are also all-ages family-friendly drag shows, and so this would have been all-ages family-friendly drag shows, that what she was excited about was the imagination aspect, the dressing up, the performing. I remember, you know, practicing like lip syncing. and doing choreography. And a lot of that came from drag and seeing just how wonderful it is to just be yourself. And that message, I think, is so powerful, no matter what the identities of the kids involved in Drag Story Hour. Because this was before Drag Story Hour was the thing. It would have been 18 or so years ago. But even just like the celebration of imagination, creativity, glitter, glamour, show... person-ship, I don't know what to say, showmanship, show person-ship, right? And the centering of femininity, you know, which is traditional in drag, even though we have so many wonderful drag kings too, was what was really powerful. for her, especially because there were so many masc people in her life. She was surrounded by so many trans masc people and queer men. so drag was like, yes, all the girliness and the femininity and the beauty and the makeup and the nails and the dress and the music. It's fabulous. It's just fabulous, if nothing else. And why do we want to take that away from anybody, especially children? who love imagination. don't know if that makes sense, but. Oh yeah, well I think it makes a good point because all ages drag shows versus adult shows. When we get an invite and we've been lucky to be at Pride like I think for the last three years now, I know I do the artist chat and I make it very clear, no more, no PG-13 perhaps, but nothing strong with the music, no F words, none. Maybe a damn, maybe a hell, maybe a shit. but we are performing in front of a mixed audience with very small children, like three, four years on up. And I always tell them, we have our venues where we perform, it's adults only. We can get raunchy. We can do our show, our rated, X rated songs. We can do the adult gestures and whatnot. But when we're doing an all ages show, let's tap into... Let this be creative, you know? Like I remember one artist said, I don't know how to do that because I've never done it. I said, well, now there's a great opportunity for you to expand that part of your art. If this is what you like to do. And they did great. They're like, oh my God, I'm a little intimidated. I said, just listen to a bunch of songs, you know? And they found something and they said, oh my God, I've got the, and the kids loved them. they just afterwards they're like, that was so much fun. And they couldn't wait to do the next. all ages show, which is the point, you know. But it is about fun, and it is about imagination, and it is about... I think as adults, we are told that we need to be adults and that we are not to be frivolous. And I think what an All Ages drag show allows everyone to do. You you can have the excuse, maybe excuse of, I'm bringing my kids or my nieces, nephews, nieblets to a drag show or my friends' kids to an All Ages drag show. But I wonder. As some of these adults, isn't that a grand excuse to be like, I get to also, you know, have that childlike glee and wonder and just let it go, let it go. Just enjoy and get caught up in the art and the imagination and the creativity and the music, you know, and hand, you know, tipping and it's so fun to tip, you know, because we just love. We love it when it's at all ages because the little ones come up with their dollar bills and we all melt. You can just see us just physically turn into piles of ghoul on the stage with these children. And it's just, it's just love. It's love from us to them. And one of the things I always say, you know, at Pride is you are our best hope. You are the next generations. You are hope and you are what we pour everything into because you'll be better than us and hopefully have more opportunities than we did and bust down more doors than we did. And again, just to build on the shoulders that you're standing upon, I want these kids who watch us now to be like, I watched drag and I understood that I could do whatever I wanted to do creatively. I didn't have to ask for permission. didn't matter that I was Black or Brown or Indigenous. I could be up on that stage. It didn't matter if I wanted to do, you know, feminine drag, masc drag, androgynous, gender fluid drag. That was okay. What mattered was I could do art that spoke to people. I could do art that made people think. I could do art that made my heart sing regardless. That's what this is all about is connecting with people and saying, was the show? And they said, I loved it because I could, this number or that number, or when your artists did this and they go, I got tears in my eyes or I felt such joy. It's like, then we did our job. Then that to us is a successful show is when we have people go, we come back because we feel this joy and we feel, we just feel and I think we are told so much, in this regime that we're in now, we're supposed to conform and not question and numb ourselves. And I think really that's what they're afraid of, you know, is because when you do art and when you tap into art or when you see art and you feel art and art is telling you Don't conform, don't give up, resist, don't give in. Support is community, support as all of us standing together. No regime wants to hear that. No fascist regime, no authoritarian regime wants to hear fight back and it doesn't have to be violence. It can be many different ways of fighting. back and if that's the nourishment that we're giving people, you're right. We are dangerous. We should be stopped because we're giving a message that they don't want given out to everyone, to the public, to nourish, to guide, maybe to spark. And I think that's to go back to what we first started about, right? Which is what is so dangerous about drag so dangerous about even Transcendence cabaret. It's because we are trying to provide different blueprints of joy and creativity and resistance. And I hate saying strength because you know got to be strong. That's really hot but strength and uh networking and connection and to provide all those different important parts. um to people who might have lost hope or are losing hope and provide hope. Rebellions are built on hope. There's my geek part coming out, right? And that's true. I remember Andor Season 2, oh my gosh, what a brilliant season. Like they said, they did this three years before. They storyboarded this three years before. This wasn't a three years now, we know what this is gonna be like. God, why would we want that three years from now? But here we are. And Andor gave that whole epic storyline about what does the empire do? What does a fascist regime do? What stories does it tell? Who does it make, right? The victims. Exactly. And then what does the resistance do to resist that? It's not always the big grand gestures. It's sometimes the small trickle, that steady stream. And if we are part of that steady stream in small ways, or we're seen as a big resistor in big ways, which puts a target on our backs. I'm aware of that. well. Absolutely, I love that that's where the conversation is going because in a way drag is resistance. Drag is resistance to, you know, um the normativity of like, is resistance to cis-gender or mononormativity is resistance to rigid gender norms. And in that way, it's also resistance to colonialism is resistance to white supremacy is resistance to fascism. And I don't think it's an accident that kind of oppressive regimes like the current fascist regime kind of targets intellectuals, artists, trans people, know, drag artists. You're right. We're dangerous because we invite people to keep dreaming, to keep dreaming into possibility, to ask questions. And I always say to people, let's just think about who benefits when you stop asking questions. Like who really benefits when we stop asking questions, when we stop dreaming, when we stop playing, because that's the other thing, right? You were saying like, as adults, we're told that some things are frivolous, right? Like play. And yet we need play. So drag is also form of play and joy and just celebration and community. and in that becomes a threat when we want people to just focus on. producing and upholding a system that only certain people benefit from, right? And so in that way, a dumping, it's an accident that Drag Story Hour, for example, has been so targeted because it does invite children to like dream into the fact that play doesn't have to end uh when you become an adult. Play might change, but we can still play dress up. we can still play make believe, we can still test artistic boundaries, and we can still honor each other's creativity. And I think drag is such a beautiful celebration of that. It's, you know, I tear up at drag shows and then I feel a little embarrassed because, you know, it's fun, it's a drag show, but it's the emotions move. You know, and I'm so excited. I had so many thoughts when you were talking. The other thing that I love, it's also that drag shows are interactive. You were talking about kids coming up with their little $1 bills, right? And in a way, that's also teaching children the mutuality of art, right? The artist is giving you a show and you're showing them appreciation, but like. clapping and making noises and participating and giving money if you can, right? To say thank you. it's like, there is a, it's not a transactional relationship. It's a, there's a mutuality for me to good drag shows, if that makes sense. Yeah, it sure does. mean, the money, I mean, we're not gonna, like Dolly said, it takes a lot of money to make me look this cheap, right? And it takes a lot of money to make a drag artist look as wonderful as they look. don't, I'm not, I'm never gonna like get back all the money I've put into my outfits and the makeup and whatnot. But that's not the point. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I think there's just so many misunderstandings. So I'm glad we're talking about all of this. I feel like this is a conversation that could have for a long time, but do want to be respectful of your time. And you did mention safety. And so I do want to take a moment to think about, especially a troupe like Transcendence, right, with the centering of, you know, Black, Indigenous, Folks of Color and trans artists. You know, I'm assuming there might be some feelings of unease or concerns maybe around safety, not only physical safety, but also emotional and psychological safety because of the onslaught of like transphobic messages and racist messages and ableist, you know, messages that we keep hearing every day. So How are you and your troupe and also your house? Cause you also have the house of yes. I believe you're the Zaddy house dad of the house of yes. How are folks in your circle doing in terms of all of those safety concerns at the moment? thank you for that. uh I guess we're doing. uh I've reached out to my artists. I'm going to be writing something on Instagram the next day or so, a statement from us, adjusting the ramped up transphobic, the targeting against trans people and the transphobic, really hateful messaging that is coming out and also kind of like the urging of violence. Mm-hmm. And first of we're not going anywhere. Our art's here to stay. So there's that. And to balance that as always, there's a safety of my artists. So I've told my people, you get to decide if you need to step back from, I mean, that literal and the figurative spotlight. You get to decide if this is too much for you emotionally to handle because it's emotionally, it's a lot. for our communities right now, for day-to-day stuff, not to mention, we are specifically going on a stage to specifically celebrate trans art. this might not go wrong at all, and I'm nothing ever happens. um But my main concern is the safety and emotional and mental well-being of my artists and my artists in my house of yes to make sure, hey. and I do those check-ins, are you okay? Do you need anything? What can I do to support you as your show director and producer? And I think one of the pleas I'll make to our general audience are twofold. One is of course to speak up and defend. And the other is to just come to our shows because resistance means you're telling us we shouldn't support. trans people, while we're going to double down and say, no, you know, we're going to go to the shows with trans artists. We're going to like buy tickets and tip money and sponsor shows or be, uh as I like to say, the patron of the arts, you know, we're going to, we're going to do that because that, that's really, that's really important. You know, it's not transactional. like that. You know, we don't do it like that. We're always grateful and humbled when we get that support. But safety is important. I worry before each show. Now, I worry about our safety. When we perform at, the Black Heart, they have security ah in other places. ah We don't necessarily have something set in place at our monthly shows. and I've had discussions with Phoenix Theater. And I think... if, and I don't want to say when, but if violent acts occur and take up here in the Twin Cities targeted acts against my trans non-binary Two-Spirit communities, we might have to take a second look and go, what is the safest thing for us as artists and for our audience too? You know, it's not just us who might be targeted and harmed. It could be anyone, you know, coming to enjoy our art. And that would just, that would devastate me. Everything, all this is devastating to think about. So that's very much on my mind is to continue to do the art. But if this encouragement of violence towards our marginalized trans communities, especially Black and Brown people, especially them, especially our Two-Spirit siblings um are encouraged and supposed to level up, so to speak. I worry a lot. I worry about this. mean, and I don't want to like grab worried. I don't want to spread anxiety because that's awful either to live in fear because that's what they want, right? They want us to hop around. yeah. So Alex, it's really multifaceted. It's not only we should have to, but we also need to be mindful of. We should be able to be artists and we also get to take good care of ourselves. We also want to have a great audience and we want to be careful for their safety. So it's all these multifaceted moving, small moving parts that make up this big picture that I that I think about before our shows and I keep an eye on what is going on in the greater community in Minneapolis. What acts of violence have been perpetrated? What is the pulse? Are we still safe? And then, you know, I don't want to say we'd stop. Would we move to hybrid only, an online platform? We might. We might have to do that, but I don't think we want to stop doing the art. I think if we stop doing the art, um they win. And I'm not ever going to let a fascist regime win. And I agree. know, as somebody is like, like, I mean, we're same generation, but like I remember there have been times when we've had to be more underground. Like there'd be, you know, even as brought up in Italy, I remember going to my first queer places in Italy. They were much more underground. was like no signage outside. You know, there'd be like this garage door would open up at like 10 o'clock at night and the club is in there. And they checked like who you are. and your name and they have a record because that's how we keep ourselves safe too sometimes. And so I know we will not stop. We will find ways to keep coming together as a community, you know, and I love that you and I have, of course, it's, I'm zero surprised that you prioritize and center the safety of the community because that's what drag also is, is community, is family, is belonging. And it's safety within community, safety in numbers. We come together, we know we're not alone, even when the regime would rather have us isolated. oh Well, we're coming towards the end of our time together, but one of the questions I've been asking all my interviewees at the moment is like, yes, the world is bleak and somehow we resist, we find ways to like nourish ourselves. give ourselves some like nourishment, pleasure, joy, comfort. What's nourishing you, giving you pleasure and comfort nowadays, even no matter how small it is. uh good, what's nourishing? um Spending time with my sons is always nourishing. In fact, my oldest and I just went and saw Demon Slayer, Infinity Castle last night in the movie theater that was grand. That was really cool. That made me very happy. um I think it goes back to community though. I love getting together with my house of yes, we do that. I love seeing my troupe. We've got three shows upcoming here in October. I'm so excited. got, yep, October 3rd, good Lord, it's the end of September. Oy vey, So October, I'm very excited to see everybody. just, one of my troupe members just got married. That was a big celebration. She got married and I officiated the wedding and I remember asking her kind of jokingly at the beginning, am I to you? And she just looked at me and she said, you know, you're a producer, you're my family, you're the patriarch. And it's like, I can't, don't know if I can continue fishing at this wedding. I'm gonna start balling, you know? It was so much joy. It's so much happiness. And as we're doing that and as we're celebrating, again, that's resistance. And I think it's those things that nurture me that make me happy, that give me self-care is, I mean, honestly, just the fact that I'm breathing and doing my thing, I know really makes people mad. It's like too bad. If we do it out of spite, sometimes spite is more than enough. absolutely. I have a little powered by spite sticker. So like my family knows, I'm very powered by spite personally. So I so relate to what you just said. And then the last thing I always ask everybody on Gender Stories is, is there anything that we haven't talked about that you are hoping to talk about or anything that you would like to leave the Gender Stories listeners or watchers, if you're watching this on YouTube, with at the end of the episode. That's a good one. um You know, I think I just want to reiterate that um it's a hard time living in. It is a fascist government. know people might disagree, but from what I'm seeing and what they're doing, if it's not fascist, it's fascist light, that's for sure. It's the run up to it real fast. And I want people to remember they're not alone. They want us to divide, conquerors what they want, and they want us to despair. and the darkest days of the AIDS crisis in the nineties, when I was losing my friends, my chosen family, when I was going to funerals, when I was seeing the government again turn its back on us, we took care of each other. Our community took care of each other. That's where my drag started in 1990, 91, 92 is to do drag. for fundraisers for our nonprofits who took care of our HIV and AIDS community, people who had HIV and AIDS in the community because no one else would. So that's why anything I have to say is don't lose hope. Falter, but don't Get back up. Don't despair. We are here. We're connected. They can't take away our joy. They can't take away our presence. They can't take away who we are. As we've said, trans people have always been here. We've been here from age millennium. We will always be here now and in the future. BIPOC trans, know, everybody, our Two-Spirit people have always been here, regardless of colonization and genocide. Maybe we should take a page from our Indigenous um compatriots and siblings and friends and. caretakers across the globe, resist, always resist. And if things get hard, it's okay to be afraid and it's okay to be sad. It's okay to have all those feelings. But every one of those governments have fallen, Alex. Everyone, look at the history, they've risen, they've fallen, and we've always been here to take care of each other, to pick up those pieces, and build something better. What a beautiful message. Thank you, Eun Bee Yes. What a beautiful message to leave the Gender Stories listeners and watchers with and dear Gender Stories listeners, if you're excited about watching a show of Transcendence Cabaret, don't worry because all of the links, of course, are going to be in the episode description. And so you can join those shows from anywhere and you can tip the performers through the uh gifts of electronic, you know, webs, so don't worry, like get those tickets, watch the show is wonderful, and maybe that's one of the ways that you get to practice cultivating hope. And so I hope you find ways to connect with playfulness, with joy, with creativity, with expansiveness, so that you can keep resisting, and until next time.