Writing Her Identity with October Ryan

Born in a small pentecostal coal-mining town in the Appalachian Mountains, October Ryan struggled to express her true self from a very early age. When her femininity was met with hate, anger, & abuse, she retreated into a series of approval-seeking fake personas. The pentecostal pastor-in-training, the meek academic bookworm, the rebellious grad school party boy, the small town psychology professor... none of her false identities gave October any sense of peace. When she moved to the diverse haven of LA, she finally came out as a proud transgender woman. While healing her traumas & beginning her transition, she wrote & published her first novel, The Beginning Of October, heavily inspired by the pain in her post & her hopes for the future, and has recently released a new murder mystery novel, The Book of Monahan. October has also co-written and released her debut album, Homecoming, co-written and produced by American Idol runner-up and chart-topping artist Blake Lewis. For more on October, check out octoberryan.com.

Transcript

Alex Iantaffi: 0:35

Welcome to another episode of gender stories, and I'm thrilled to be here with October Ryan. October was born in a small Pentecostal coal mining town in the Appalachian Mountains. She struggled to express her true self from a very early age. When October's femininity was met with hate, anger and abuse, she retreated into a series of approval seeking fake persona. The Pentecostal pastor in training, the unique academic bookworm the rebellious grad school party boy, the small town psychology professor, none of her false identities gave October any sense of peace. When she moved to the diverse haven of LA, she finally came out as a proud transgender woman. While healing her traumas and beginning her transition she wrote and published her first novel, The Beginning of October, heavily inspired by the pain in her past, and her hopes for the future. And she's recently released a new murder mystery novel The Book of Monahan, which is really wonderful. So, you know, really Gender Stories readers, get it, read it, we're gonna talk about it. And hopefully, you'll feel motivated to get the book but I've read I've had the privilege to read it, and it's great. October is also co written and released her debut album homecoming, co written and produced by American Idol runner up and charttopping artist Blake Louis. And for more on October you check, you can check out her website, Octoberryan.com, which of course is also going to be in the episode description. Welcome, October. What a wonderful pleasure to have you on gender stories.

October Ryan: 2:12

Thank you, Alex. It's wonderful to be here. Sorry, my dog picked at the precise moment that we started to start making noise.

Alex Iantaffi: 2:19

Oh, that's okay. I mean, it's wonderful to have paps on the interview. We've had like baby noises and interviews, pop noises. They're all welcome. And now that we have both the, you know, the audio just on podcasts, listening platforms, and the video on YouTube, people also get to see the puppies or the babies. So that's wonderful.

October Ryan: 2:41

Bring her back at some point, but she's in her naughty corner.

Alex Iantaffi: 2:45

Oh, that's okay. If she comes back, we will welcome her make her part of the interview. I'm pretty sure nobody's gonna mind a little bark here. and there, we understand. So um, I would love to talk with you first of all around your writing, right? It's lately I feel I've been talking to a lot of people about the role that writing has had in their gender journey. And it sounds like especially with your first novel, that's definitely been part of your writing. And so yeah, anything that you want to share about how your writing has kind of been part of your own gender journey and your own self understanding?

October Ryan: 3:23

Yeah, I mean, the writing has saved me. I really, really struggled with transitioning and coming out. And I've never been good at expressing my feelings to people, I'm always kind of on high alert, like, I'll say what you want me to say, so you just don't probe any farther. But when I started writing, I started finding my voice. And the music, you know, was was great for me to express my emotions. But I wanted to write a book that was it's not an autobiography, I had to tell my mother that. She's like, Oh, my God, did this really happen? I'm like, no, no, no calm down. But it was inspired by my life. And I realized when I finished it, that it was so much more about my perspective than I even realized. In fact, that's when I actually legally changed my name to October was after I wrote the book, and, and saw the meaning that that had for me. So I mean, really just the writing has saved me in so many ways.

Alex Iantaffi: 4:26

That is really wonderful to hear. And I know that's very much true for me, as well as, even though I write nonfiction, I still feel that when I write, it really helps me better understand myself better understand people. And I'm really curious whether you were writing before or if you're writing really started to thrive and flourish, after you started to come out even to yourself. I mean, I don't know, for me, there was definitely a process of figuring it out for myself, right? Nobody usually tells you, hey, you're trans. So I wonder what that process was like for you.

October Ryan: 5:01

So I wrote so much when I was a little kid, I had this book series called Reuben the Robin. I can still picture it. And I wrote a song lyrics all throughout college too. But when I entered the work world, like the adult life, I suppose you'd say, I blocked all that out, and I just put it to the side and I didn't really start doing it again until right before I officially came out, I'd been playing with drag a little bit and you know, the first time I felt free to Do that. And I was realizing how good it was to express myself the way that I'd always wanted. So the writing just kind of came naturally from that. And then the more I did it, the more I wanted to do. I mean, I have a spreadsheet on my computer of all seven books in this particular series I'm writing right now. It's my favorite thing in the world.

Alex Iantaffi: 6:00

That's wonderful. So it's going to be a seven book series. I know there's a book. I know there is more coming, but I didn't know how many so now I know we can look forward to many more books in this series, and I'm very excited personally. So let's talk about your new book, the Book of Monahan. So you went from more kind of, you know, fictional back kind of inspired by things in your life first book, to more of kind of a mystery series. So yeah, tell me about why in mystery series, I also don't want to give people spoilers, so just share whatever you want to share about the book and Monahan and the series, generally, and what inspired you to write this series?

October Ryan: 6:45

Yeah, I was a big fan of a show called Father Dowling Mysteries when I was a little kid. I really wanted to be Sister Stephanie, I kind of still do want to be Sister Stephanie. But I've always loved True Crime mysteries. There's something about being presented with a question that's really, really difficult, but knowing that there will be an answer, and you're going to be the one that navigates that there's something really fulfilling about that for me. I think it's because my whole life was a question that I was always trying to figure out. So I love again, I love spreadsheets. So I love having seeds, and clues and red herrings and all these things that enter kind of intertwine into one long story where I know the answer, but the reader doesn't. That's really, really satisfying for me.

Alex Iantaffi: 7:38

Yeah, that makes sense. And there's something about I think that like you said, mystery where there is a sense of like, everything will become clearer, right, which often is not like life, unfortunately, more complicated than that. But often in mysteries, I feel like either Trans and Queer People don't exist, or if we exist in those worlds, we don't fare well, right? Often trans folks are depicted as either the villains or the victims. And so I'm wondering how you navigated, again, without giving too many spoilers to listeners, that how did you navigate representation in something like mystery series, when it comes to LGBTQI plus characters,

October Ryan: 8:27

I really wanted to be very intentional with the character, I didn't want it to be a huge, dramatic reveal. I didn't want the character to be kind of the idea that they're transgender dominating every aspect of their life. So I made the intention to not even reveal who is transgender until a couple of chapters in and it's again, that's not part of the mystery, it hopefully comes up very organically. But no, I agree. That's when I started writing, I realized that there are so many types of people who are not represented, especially as the as a main character. So that was really exciting. It's a little nerve racking, because when I was writing the beginning of October, that was a trans female who was based on me, that may or may not be the case in this book. I guess that's a tad bit of a spoiler. So I wanted to make sure that I was being sensitive and that I wasn't. I wasn't saying or doing anything that would make anyone uncomfortable in the queer community. So there's a little bit of pressure there. But no, I'm really proud of it. And the way that that reveal came out, I was really happy with it.

Alex Iantaffi: 9:46

Yeah. And I love what you said that the reveal is not part of the mystery, right? Because often it's like, yes, have made some of us that remember, the terribly trans misogynistic, like reveal on the Crying Game, for example, in terms of movies, and obviously no trans folks usually want to replicate that kind of centered representation. And so I'm really curious about how did you navigate trans character there was not the maybe I had an experience that was different from Iran as a trans person, right? Did you like feel like you were drawing from communityknowledge Did you ask feedback from other folks and everybody navigates that process a little bit differently? So I'm curious about your process as a writer in navigating this.

October Ryan: 10:39

Like I said, it was something I took very seriously, I don't have a large network of people. I've been in LA several years, but it's very difficult to make actual connections here. So what I what I tried to do, honestly, as I started from a place of, you know, my, my dream person, I have to be so careful here not to,. But I really thought of someone who identified as the gender that they are, regardless of it being cis or trans. That was my starting point. So again, it wasn't that I was trying to hide who's who it's that this person is the gender that they are, and there are so many qualities attached to that. And then, um, it's probably wasn't the best way. But I'm a big fan of a podcast called Jay & Miles X-Plain the X-Men . And one of the hosts... are you familiar?

Alex Iantaffi: 11:33

A little bit? Yes. Yeah.

October Ryan: 11:36

And I started listening before one of the characters transitioned, and I was still in the closet back then. And so it really, honestly was very educational. For me, I've learned more about the queer community from that podcast than I have my own life experiences. So I kind of tried to base it on, not base it on, let's be careful, lightly inspired by a lot of the experiences that one of the hosts had shared throughout those podcasts.

Alex Iantaffi: 12:07

Yeah, and I love that you said inspired by, right, because I think we do need to kind of see ourselves sometimes to understand ourselves, right? I believe that this week, while we're recording, it's actually banned books week. And I was really thinking about this idea of like, what happens when we can see ourselves, right, I know that for myself, you know, growing up in the 70s, in Italy, there wasn't a lot of representation. Luckily, anime and manga were really popular. And so I remember that, you know, I think the title in English is The Rose of Versailles. And it's this characters assigned female at birth, as actually very masculine. It's like the guard, one of the guards of Marie Antoinette, right. And I didn't know that I was trans when I was in elementary school. But I was so attached, right to this TV series, because the part of me was like, oh, you know, trans masc representation, we could call it nowadays, but that's not what was happening in the 70s. and easily, I've never been a trans masc person that I knew. All right. And so yeah, I'm really thinking a lot about books and representation, and what happens when we can see experiences that maybe we don't have yet language for, or when we hear experiences, through podcasts, episodes, and so on. And so I'm wondering what that process of finding yourself was like for you as somebody who was, like you said, in your bio, you know, brought up in a small coal mining town in the Appalachian Mountains, maybe, I don't know if there were trans folks in your community or not, or, yeah, I'm just curious about your own journey of finding yourself and whether books or other people's writing and the role in that.

October Ryan: 13:53

I was. So in the closets. I mean, I there were no trans open, openly trans people. Where I grew up, there were no openly gay people where I grew up to admit any kind of gay stereotype was even something that was heavily judged. I'm processing a lot of trauma now from the church that I went to, I literally thought I was going to hell, every day until I was in my early 20s. And you know that you hear that and it's like, Oh, that sucks. But to think about a little kid whose daily reality is I'm going to the eternal place of punishment. I'm so passionate about understanding and really letting people know about the trauma that's being caused in churches every day. It's, it's something that I think people don't want to talk about, because they don't want to be expensive, but there are kids killing themselves because of what you're experiencing in these churches. And religion, you know, plays a big, big part in The Book of Monaghan, for that reason, I didn't even see a gay person that I related to until The Real World New Orleans, so as a queer person named Danny and so I came out as gay when I was 24. But then, I just had such a hard time with that, that I really retreated my gender. I was comfortable you know what, having sex with men, but in some ways, I felt like I had to overcompensate like I can't be the girly gay, because that's too Far, and people would compliment me, you know, not knowing that it was harmful, saying, Oh, I'm just so glad you're not one of those femme gays. And, you know, deep down, I knew I was, but I couldn't even consciously go there. So it really wasn't until I moved to LA, when I was 39, that I started allowing myself to admit things that I love, that are super femme. I mean, I still have a hard time expressing my femmeness, like to be honest. And deep down. I know, I am like, the twirliest girliest girl that I've ever known in my life. It's just so hard for me to express that because of the trauma. So unfortunately, there wasn't a lot of fiction that inspired me if anything, it was people brave enough to share their authentic stories. Be it Danny from The Real World, or more recently, RuPaul's Drag Race, several of the transgender characters, there have been a huge information. inspiration for me, Sasha Colby, has been so crucial in my coming out experience over the last few years. So yeah, it's interesting that I'm pursuing the world of fashion. But it really is kind of those real authentic heroes that have inspired me the most.

Alex Iantaffi: 16:57

Absolutely, that that makes a lot of sense, because we've had so much more visibility even over the last decade when it comes to trans representation, which I think has been really wonderful and life saving, like you said, for a lot of people because, unfortunately, you know, we're just at the, you know, just after September, which is also Suicide Prevention Month, I believe. And, you know, in our community, suicidality is 10 times the rate of cisgender communities, mostly because, you know, sometimes it's hard for trans folks, not only to face all the systemic violence in the world, but even to conceive ourselves, right, in a world where we are, at best erased, and at worst, you know, murdered or represented as villains, and so on. And so I am curious, in your own writing, why you chose to go more the fictional route than nonfiction or route, whether you've thought about writing a memoir, especially given that your first book really does draw on your experiences, what made you go like the more the fictional route than the non fictional memoir route, for example, that some trans folks have gone down?

October Ryan: 18:08

Simple answer, fear.

Alex Iantaffi: 18:11

Yeah, that's legit.

October Ryan: 18:15

It's really hard for me to go back to some of the real experiences that I've had, it's safer for me to create a world where I know things will end okay, for me to explore them, but I actually am working on an autobiography right now. I hope to have it out next year, but I want it's still going to be it's going to have a creative thread that I think is protecting me so a little bit, it's going to be kind of like song lyrics as a tool to explore my life. So yeah, it's a fear thing. And it really is.

Alex Iantaffi: 18:53

I really hear that honestly, because I have been having this like vague idea about a memoir, but like a spiritual memoir for some time. And I'm like, throwing up put this out there, do I want not want to put this out there? Do I want it to be partially fictional? Because there is a little bit of a, I think there's a little bit of a protective shell that we grow also as trans folks in a very transphobic world, right? And especially when we experience rejection or trauma, both, you know, familial or religious, that can be fear. So I really feel that and I empathize with you on that and and I love that you're bringing music into it right and song lyrics because music I think it's another way in which sometimes we can make sense of ourselves. And so you both write and make can use it to what how do you see the relationship between those two different things you feel like they express different sides of you I think, like you said, you know, with songs is more about emotional processing, maybe compared to other types of writing. So yeah, I would love to hear a little bit more about your process and how you move from one style of writing to another writing.

October Ryan: 20:06

I started writing song lyrics that was if we're talking about adult me, and in a different way, it's like a puzzle for me that's very satisfying. So finding words that rhyme finding the right number of syllables to say a phrase that you want to say. It's very much a puzzle in a unique way. And it's I love I love writing music, a little bit more than that. Like writing, writing books. But I think it's very autobiographical. For me every song I've written. And I've written all but one of the songs on my first two albums. They come from a very, very deep place. And if I always tell people if you want to know me, or you think you know me and listen to some of the songs I've written, then you will know me better than any conversation you've ever had with me. That's where I feel the safest. You know, writing in fiction, it's a different kind of puzzle that I enjoy. It's, you know, I want I have these characters. I know how they relate to each other. I know where I want them to ends up. How do I get them there in a way that's unpredictable, but also logical, it surprises you. But it makes sense based on what you know. So I have a little touch of obsessive compulsive disorder. And so these two areas, it's really about problem solving for me, and it's so fun. Yeah,

Alex Iantaffi: 21:38

I mean, some of us love attention to detail, right? And I love that you keep mentioning like, puzzles, because in a way, that's different types of puzzles. And sometimes, figuring out that we're trans can be its own puzzle, right? And so I'm wondering what that tipping point was like for you, right? Because in your bio, you say, you know, you tried all these different types of approval seeking personas, right? What what is going to work? And so sounds to me, like you were very much trying to solve the puzzle of October, right? Who is October? How do I find myself and again, I have a lot of empathy. I think a lot of trans folks go through that. I know, I went from my own kind of puzzle and journey to find myself. And so I'm wondering, like you said, you know, a piece of that was moving to LA. But what was it that allowed you to go into actually, I'm not a gay man, I'm a trans woman. And it because you were talking about like overcompensating because I think it is different for everybody. And I'm wondering if your own journey could be helpful to one of the listeners?

October Ryan: 22:43

Yeah. It's interesting, it was during the COVID lock down, when I finally admitted that I was trans. And I had a podcast called the Positive Psychology of Pop Music that I did. And I had just interviewed one of my good friends about the Black Lives Matter movement, and listening to him talk about all of these systematic ways that culture just accepts racism, you know, it's not that you're racist, or you're not, it's that it's so built in that we don't even see it when it's happening. And I started looking at my life through that lens through the same thing, but with gender. And I had this euphoric feeling when we ended the interview, I put on a wig immediately, and was just kind of like, flitting around my apartment. But then I had a panic attack, because I realized what being trans meant for me. And it meant potentially losing family members, it meant, you know, having to redo my entire life in my mind. So I went to the American Psychological Association website, and I spent hours looking for what might make you think you're trans when you're not? What disorder might make you think you're transgender? I was so desperate to find another answer for the way that I felt. And, you know, a panic attack crying for hours. And then I finally was brave enough to take the gender dysphoria survey that they have, and I scored off the charts. So it really was through the course of that day that I came out loved it got terrified, wanted a different answer, and then kind of accepted it. But the accepting and has been, it's been such a process. I actually tried to commit suicide in between my first book and The Book of Monahan. Just because it's so overwhelming to, to look at my life through an honest lens, and all the things I've done all the things that happened to me. It's very, very much a journey that I'm still navigating. I've learned to kind of appreciate that in a way that when I have euphoria, when I have a great feeling, I tell myself, there's going to be so many more of these in ways I haven't even considered yet. And when I kind of latched on to that perspective, I found it to be true that you know, there will be bad times there will be days when I just don't feel like I know who I am. But it always comes back to those euphoric moments where I look at myself and I smile, and I can't believe I'm finally Looking in the mirror without flinching, or, you know, I'm, I'm walking around my house naked. That was something that was off limits for me before. So it's a journey. But I'm finally able to say that it's an exciting one that I'm looking forward to.

Alex Iantaffi: 25:52

I'm sorry that you went through that as, as many of us do in community. And I'm very glad that you're here. I know that for myself, I do a very similar, like, remember that life is surprising. But it cannot surprise you if you're not here for it. Right? Like, that's for me like that reminder, when I'm having a bad day and around suicidality, right? It's like, you don't know what tomorrow is gonna bring? Or what next year is gonna bring because there's been so many surprises in the past, right? And holding on to those euphoric moments, those moments where we see ourselves can be hard on the rough days, right. But so, so glad that you're here and that you did all bound to those euphoric moments. I am curious about what would you say to other folks who are maybe in a similar situation, right, that fear, I've heard this, I know, I've navigated it, for myself have supported a lot of people in navigating it, as the therapists, you know, especially I know, when I've worked with transfemme folks, there's so such a big fear of losing everything, right? My life is gonna blow up, I'm gonna lose everything, which makes sense, because there's so much transmisogyny. And I think there's like different challenges that transfemme folks face for sure. And so there can be so much fear, right, my life is gonna be terrible, everything is gonna blow up. And and in a way on paper, it looks like you've been thriving in terms of your creativity, actually, since coming out. And so yeah, I wonder what you would say to maybe other trans feminine folks who are in the throes of I wish I wasn't trans or there must be some other reason why I feel this way, right. And we're very much struggling with that fear of losing everything.

October Ryan: 27:41

It's rough. It really is. And I think we have to acknowledge that. I remember hearing the It Gets Better campaign and having a little bit of a negative reaction to that. Because it doesn't always get better for some people, or it's Yeah. And I think we have to face that as a reality. So we take better care of our books and in the queer community. What I would say to anyone struggling is something that's that's been said to me for years. But it took me a long time to realize feelings aren't facts. And I think because I pushed all of my authentic feelings so far down, when they started to come up, they were overwhelming. I don't think I cried in front of anyone until I was until I was in my early 40s. Because the feelings were terrifying to me. And so when they came out, they felt overwhelming. They felt like I can't handle this, this is the end. But it's so helpful to take a step back and go, I didn't feel this way yesterday, I know I didn't. So it's possible. I won't feel this way tomorrow, not only possible, it's likely. Because I feel so bad right now. It really is just statistically likely that it's going to get better and better. And I love what you said a few minutes ago, Alex, the world can surprise us, but only if we're here and only if we're showing up for it. And so there's so many things that are going to happen to you that you can't hope for yet. Because you don't even know that they're going to feel so great for you. You don't even know all the good stuff that's coming. And so really just hold on to that and to ask for help. Don't feel any shame in that. That's why I try to be as open as I can about my suicide attempts. I think we need to know to normalize those feelings and those fears and address them head on. And you know, if somebody if you're worried about someone, ask them, ask them if they're doing okay, if they thought about taking their own life, you're not going to give them the idea. That doesn't happen. But I think some people are just so scared to broach that topic, but we need to talk about it because people going through that need their feelings to be heard and validated.

Alex Iantaffi: 29:59

Absolutely. And I love what you said about feelings. I'm not facts, right? I often talk about that in therapy as well, like feelings are valid and they're real. Absolutely. But they're not facts. And often our trauma brain tells us terrible things about ourselves. Right? And it's and it's very hard because it feels so real so overwhelming. And I know that writing can be a really good way also of getting those feelings out right because sometimes I can feel I don't know about you, but I know for myself sometimes the feelings feel like almost too big, right for the container of our bodies. And so finding a way of expressing them can be so helpful. Through songs through writing through. Yes, or, you know, just anything that shifts us out of just keeping it all in our head and in our heart can be so helpful. Yeah, and I'm curious talking about life surprising us for the world surprising us, was kind of your creativity, flourishing something that surprised you after coming out, because sounds like you were big creative as a child. But then that kind of dried up, which again, I think it's not uncommon for a lot of trans folks. As more feelings come up, then the creativity goes down. Because often, you know, that's where those feelings come up. And we want to keep them away, right? And so was your creativity flourishing after coming out as yourself like something that surprised you? Or something that you're like, this makes sense? Or something else? What was your experience of that?

October Ryan: 31:38

It definitely surprised me in two different ways. I was surprised by how much was coming out. I mean, I've only been doing this for three years. And I've written this is my third book, and I'm about to release my third album. So it's, it's still kind of hard to accept how much is still in there. Like I have so many more things I want to do. The bigger way It surprised me though, was the pride I felt with it. I've never felt proud of anything I did in my life. And I never knew why. Because I I achieved success in school and work and friendships and relationships. But it never not one felt authentic in a way that I was proud of. And it's, you know, I know that there are flaws in everything I do, but I don't, I don't care. Because it's authentically me. And so the fact that I'm able to talk about these things, and and just love what I'm doing, regardless of how it's received, that's a new feeling for me. And so that's the biggest surprise.

Alex Iantaffi: 32:46

I love that because, and I still resonate, right? Because sometimes people are like, Oh, that, you know, from the outside these things are successful. But unless we can really feel that's an authentic expression, it can be really hard to own our success. And so it's so wonderful to hear you say I am proud that you have achieved a lot. I mean, three books and three albums in three years, it's very prolific. I don't even know how you find the time outside. How do you find the time I know that time is definitely a big challenge for me and my creativity. So just very selfishly, how do you find the time October to kind of survive under capitalism and be so creative and productive? In your creativity?

October Ryan: 33:32

That's a great point. Because so far, it's certainly not paying for itself.

Alex Iantaffi: 33:37

Yes, it's my experience. Writing doesn't bring much money generally, even if we're successful in air quotes, or whatever, then, yeah,

October Ryan: 33:46

I think I made 12 cents off my first album. The answer is that I'm still struggling, I guess, with being social and being, you know, going out places and trying to meet people. I've never been good at that. And I'm quite fearful. So my therapist is actually trying to help me find a balance. It's so great that you're being productive creatively. But that's not going to fill the void of people in your life. And so I'm, I'm trying to let go of feeling the need to get all of my ideas out there. And being okay with them being on the backburner while I try to date or you know, dance, which is something I love to do. So the balance is rough, and it's not easy to find.

Alex Iantaffi: 34:39

I got I very much hear that too. And also, I didn't know that you love dancing. I also love dancing. And so I do have a question for you. Around dancing and gender, which is something I actually really love to talk about. Have you noticed the difference in your relationship to dance after coming out as yourself? And I'm just really curious if you did, did you dance before? Did you not let yourself dance before basically your relationship to the ends and your gender because it's such an embodied activity expression, whatever we want to call it art, right? And so I'm curious about whether you notice differences in your relationship to dance throughout your gender journey.

October Ryan: 35:21

This is my favorite question I've ever been asked.

Alex Iantaffi: 35:25

Yay!

October Ryan: 35:29

yeah, you said that so beautifully. I always love dance, but I was not able to move my body. I took ballroom dancing lessons about seven or eight years ago. And you know, I was presenting as a male at the time. And my instructor was trying to get me to loosen up my hips and she was like, What's wrong with you, and she was physically grabbing my body and to be. So, you know, dancing is a very cerebral dancing is trying to get the hip to lift. And my mind wouldn't let my body expressing your emotions, without words without any other connection, just the flow of your body. And so it's the most do that. And I wasn't even consciously aware of it. It's it beautiful thing to me, I can watch Travis Wall choreograph and dance all day long is so inspiring to me. And I'm so to me, it's still the freakiest thing. But I loved dancing, but looking forward to getting ready to take ballroom dance classes. Again, I'm looking to sign up this month. And so far, that's the biggest euphoric moment to me to be wearing a dress and to I hated dancing in couples. Because I was it was, I was be doing the dances I love as the person that I am. And, you know, being in the arms of a guy, you know, it's, it's having to embody everything I hated about myself, I was something that I wish, I wish there weren't such boundaries on areas like ballroom dancing. But I feel like they're starting to getting reinforced for it. And in my arms was the person I wanted441 open up. But you know, identifying as a woman. I'm so excited to get back out there on the dance floor.

Alex Iantaffi: 37:23

Yeah, I'm so excited for you. I've actually Totally, I'm so happy that you're getting that! just started taking ballroom classes again, last week, after not doing that for like 30 years, almost. And it's such a great feeling to go back to it because of this. So gendered ballroom, right. So I've done other types of dancing, but ballroom is so gendered but I found a lovely studio locally. That's so open, you know, our instructor was like, This is my more trans people in ballroom I have to say that Shangela name, this are my pronouns. What are your pronouns? You know, and I'm very open to kind of same gender couples, which is always also tricky, because the partner I dance with, we're both trans. And so we're like a non binary, we're like, do you want to lead you want me to lead? We want to switch off, right? How do we want to do this in a way that's fluid and fun, right, rather inspired me with being on Dancing with the Stars. And we than kind of rigid, which is more aligned than really realizing? Oh, yeah, even though I'm following, which is something I'm used to doing. It feels totally different to do that, you know, knowing why I am. Even if it's the same saps, the body feels like a level of relaxation, that is very different than when the world has expectations that came with were watching it, you know, and I was like, Yeah, ballroom, why that gender role, if that makes sense. don't I pick up ballroom dancing again? That sounds great. I'd like more trans representation of ballroom what other, you know, I feel is such a, in some ways, we're living through yet another wave right of transphobia. And I say yet another way, because it's not like this is the first time, unfortunately, but it's pretty intense in here on the so called United States. And so what are the other things that are giving you joy right now, I really have been, you know, we can definitely talk about trauma. And I mean, I've a whole book called Gender Trauma, so I can talk about trauma all day long. I'm also excited about trans joy just because it is such a depressing time at the moment. So what else is giving you joy? Besides creativity besides games nowadays? Where are you finding your nourishment?

October Ryan: 39:52

Oh my gosh. I'm a big nerd in terms of comics and video games. So one of the best things is rereading the X Men comics I did as a kid, and realizing why I identified with them. There's a character called Psylocke, who was literally put in the wrong body. And she was my favorite and I'm like, Why do I like this character so much? So reading the I tried to read a comic every night and it's so fun to be to do an adult lens. I'm excited about Halloween because as a gay man, I always felt pressure Like you have to, you have to have a costume that's attractive. And, you know, it was it was kind of irritating. I'm going to be Belle from Beauty and the Beast and I have never been more excited.

Alex Iantaffi: 40:48

I love that. Do you have your costume ready?

October Ryan: 40:51

I do I do. I actually bought it two years ago, but I wasn't brave enough to wear it. But this year, it's nothing's going to stop me I will be Belle.

Alex Iantaffi: 41:00

That is so wonderful. And I love that right? Because there's so much queer coding in cartoons often. I was just talking about this with Sage Cotugno last week in their interview, because they're in, they're in animation, right? And now there is so much more open queer representation, right? The new Shira or ours, which Sage was one of the folks who worked on that show, just that the queer representation that my kids have, it's like, mind blowing. For me, compared to our we have to find that that queer coding, right and characters for some of us who are older than, I don't know, 20 years old, let's call it right. And so I love that you're going back to comic books as a form of nourishment. And I'm also wondering if you have favorite new shows that have that kind of better queer representation that you're like, yes, this really speaks to my inner child that didn't have this.

October Ryan: 42:01

Obviously, RuPaul's Drag Race is such an inspiration, not just, you know, for the arts, and the talents of it. But I think they go so deep into who they are, and they're so willing to share, it's, that show has definitely had a big impact on me. I don't watch a lot of new television, I've been watching Mary Tyler Moore. Because again, I always watched those shows as a kid. And so there's something so freeing about revisiting them now and, and knowing why I connect with them. So well, I'm trying to think of a new show that that I love, but I really have not been watching a new TV very much. And of course, the second we're done, I'll think of like,

Alex Iantaffi: 42:50

Oh, that's okay. But I also love this idea of watching shows, again, through the lens of knowing who you are, right? That can be so powerful as well in itself, like, I'm watching, like, Mary Tyler Moore or whatever show, right. And now I know who I am. And I'm watching it with totally different eyes, then that makes complete sense to me, too. So but yes, I know, I'm the same whenever I'm put on the spot. I'm like, have I ever read a book, or watched a TV show, even though I do those things every day, no, nothing comes to my mind. It's very human. I feel like I could talk with you all day. This is so fun. And I want to be respectful of your time. And so I will ask you the question that I always ask all our guests, which is, is there anything we have not talked about that you were hoping we were talking about today?

October Ryan: 43:45

No, this has been so wonderful. I've just loved talking to you. In fact, I kind of forgot it was an interview. And, you know, just it just felt so normal and natural. So thank you. I guess I'm getting ready to put out my third album, and I'm very proud of it. It's actually about trauma. It's not depressing, but it's inspired by a lot of the things that happened. You know, getting to write and record my first album with literally one of my idols was such a gift. And, you know, it's so I still have to pinch myself that, you know, Blake Lewis, is, you know, a friend of mine and did an album with me like that still doesn't really compute. So I'm so grateful to him. He actually and his support was really influential in me being able to come out here in LA, he invited me to things and just such a cool guy I absolutely love him to death. Yeah, and I'm working on a new I'm working on the sequel to The Book of Monahan, The Book of Betancourt. And I'm really looking forward to, to getting into these characters at a new place in their lives. Because even though I wrote this, you know, less than a year ago, I already feel like I'm at a new place in my life. So there's something really exciting about going back to these characters that I've created. And being able to, I say, watch them grow as if they're, you know, their own characters, but they kind of are, you know, I'll be writing them and be like that doesn't make sense for that character. They can't do that. So I'm Just excited about the books in the music and, and dating and things like that. So, yeah, it's all it's all good right now.

Alex Iantaffi: 45:43

That's really wonderful. I'd love to hear some good solid trans joy. I think we need that right now. And so I hope that the listeners can also really hear just how beautiful and thriving your life is right now, which is wonderful. And so if there's anyone out there maybe struggling or not being in that place, knowing that that can happen is so important, I think. So if listeners want to find your music, want to find your writing, where should they go? Is there any where apart from your website, October ryan.com, that they should go like social media or, I don't know other platforms where they can find brochure music and your writing.

October Ryan: 46:29

I've actually pulled off social media on I have a very minimal presence these days. And it's been great for my mental health. So I tried to use October Ryan is the hub. My music is on Spotify, Apple Music, and then my books. They're being sold at a couple of local shops in LA. And then, you know, October ryan.com Is is really where I try to house everything.

Alex Iantaffi: 46:55

I love that I think a lot of people are withdrawing more and more from social media, because that's so depleting, I think and so you're like Yep, no, come to my website. Find me there. Absolutely.

October Ryan: 47:09

I'm not good for sales. But you know, my mental health is more important. So

Alex Iantaffi: 47:14

your mental health is absolutely more important. What a beautiful statement, I think to make. Yes, our lives are so much more important than that all this pressure of social media. What a wonderful message to end the interview on. Well, thank you so much for your time. It was so fun to have this conversation with you. I can't wait for the second book. I haven't read the first one. I'm very excited that there are six more books that I can look forward to after your first one and dear Gender stories Listeners and now watchers for those of you who are watching the episodes on YouTube. I hope that you do read The Book of Monahan as well as October's first book and listen to her albums. And that until next time, take care of yourselves.

October Ryan: 48:03

Thank you so much